165mm cranks

I've never had a professional bike fit. 

I started cycling in the late 1990s, got my first road bike (an "Airborne" -- mail order titanium frame with Ultegra components) in 2000 or so, and gradually boosted my mileage over the following decade until I was a committed Audax rider. 

I experimented with saddles and position until I could do long rides without pain or numbness. David Marx, the Assos then Q36.5 importer into Japan, whom I met relatively soon after arriving in Japan in 2004, persuaded me that high end bib shorts where well worth the investment for someone who is riding as much as I do.

I have gradually adjusted my bikes to increase comfort and avoid pain when it shows up. 

The first time I rode PBP, in 2011, I used 700x23 tires and stiff wheels. The vibrations on a descent of a chip-sealed road sent sharp pain up both arms, and my little fingers were both numb after the event for several weeks. The next time I did a 1200km ride, in 2012, I had 700x25 tires with a better setup and gel pads under my bar tape. I soon felt I had hit an equilibrium where my body could take even the longest multi-day rides without feeling too much punishment. By 2019 I was on 700x28 tires with lower pressure, and these days I mostly ride a 700x30 or 700x32 rear tire.

My main complaint has been foot pain. I have gotten "hot foot" at various times. I have tried roomier shoes, better/different insoles, cushier socks, different cleat positions, etc., gel pads under the metatarsals, and various other attempts at mitigation, but it still comes and goes. I have concluded that some shoes just don't work -- one Shimano shoe does fine, then next one does not. They are not consistent.  One is narrow through the arch, the other wide (even though neither is a "Wide" as opposed to "Medium" type, or maybe both are one or the other. One allows me to slam cleats back quite far, the other does not. Anyway, a proper fitting shoe goes a long way toward mitigating hot foot. 

A few years ago I started to occasionally get pain in my right knee when riding. And I could tell that my feet were not "stable" in position as my legs went through a full peddling rotation. Something was wrong.

I really SHOULD get a professional bike fit, but in watching various bike fitters online, they seem to have a variety of approaches and different degrees of success. And I feel as if I should be able to work through issues on my own over time with plenty of experimentation, rather than in one session. 

Anyway, on the Tohoku 1000km ride that Jerome and I started (but only got halfway through) during Golden Week, I had both my share of right knee pain and hot foot. I started to feel that I could solve one by moving my seat up/down, while making the other worse. 

So what am I going to do about it? 

For the "hot foot", first, I got some cleat adjustment adapters. These allow you to really push cleat back toward mid-foot. After they arrived, I realized that I only need them on some shoes, while others already offer a very long adjustment area for a slammed back cleat. I tried the adjusters on my newest Shimano shoes for SPD. The shoes are still uncomfortable.  Why?  I think they are just too narrow through the arch and heel -- even when I swap in a different insole. And they are narrower than other Shimano SPD shoes in the same size from a decade ago. They don't feel uncomfortable when I first put them on ... but they just don't work after 75+kms, and even the cleat adapter does not solve it.

Meanwhile, what about the knee pain?  Well, having a more "stable" leg position should help -- maybe a shim inside the right shoe to bring up the outside of my foot, which seemed to be lower than the inside? But that did not help. I decided instead to try 165mm cranks.

Why?  Well, mostly because of my youtube bike fitter, Neill Stanbury of Australia.  He appears in various Road Cycling Academy and other videos, and explains it better than I could hope to: here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fCTCyZqFGE

People go to him from all over the world and, I have got to say, if I DID get a professional bike fit then I might try to squeeze it in on a trip to Australia ... except I have not been to Australia in five years, and I might make a mistake and drive 600km north from Brisbane to see him in Kawana, when he seems located at the OTHER Kawana just north of Brisbane.  He has a great set of youtube videos on bike fit issues on the Road Cycling Academy channel.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCyklBca6SZF1tRwSYsek-ZnsNBI-GPuY

Or, since he comes from the Steve Hogg bike-fitting school, maybe I could use one of the others who has the same training and is located elsewhere ... none within a 3 hour flight of Japan, regrettably.
https://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/

One of Stanbury's clients, Cam Nicholls, took the advice and is on 165mm cranks. His explanation here: https://youtu.be/svlDq-NStcc?si=wjbsBSzwbX13sFsi

I have been using a 165mm crankset (single chainring) on the Pelso brevet recumbent since shortly after I got that bike. The original 172.5mm cranks were just too big for a comfortable pedaling rotation with my legs jutting up in the air in front of me. Indeed, many recumbent riders recommend smaller cranks than on road bikes. 

But when I suggested switching to 165mm for my road bike(s) to a bike industry veteran here, he told me it would mess up my bio-mechanics, after more than 20 years riding 172.5, and in his experience it does not solve problems. So I put it off.

But then a few weeks back, Lifetime Grand Prix gravel/mtb racer Dylan Johnson (aka "my youtube cycling coach"), in the end of a discussion of his bike setup for Gravel Unbound and/or Leadville 100 this year, let slip that he had gone to shorter, 165mm, cranks, in part as a way to eliminate knee pain that had shown up in some of his most intense, lengthy training "blocks".  (He has videos on "block periodization" as well, if you aren't familiar with the idea of a training block). He said it has worked and the pain is gone.

Also, did I mention that Tadej Pogacar, the best cyclist in the world, is riding 165mm cranks this year as he achieves the best results of his career? If it works for Dylan Johnson and Tadej Pogacar, maybe it is worth a try.

Anyway, after the massive problem with Shimano cranks that failed (it happened to Jerome back in 2020) and that ultimately led to a recall after more than a decade of complaints and denail ... I did not really feel as if I needed to pay for a new set of Shimano 105 or Ultegra cranks in order to try 165mm.  Instead, I went on Aliexpress and found a basic crankset for 8600 yen (around US$60). It arrived in a few days and was simple to swap in for my 172.5mm Ultegra. It also had 50/34 chainrings so no need to adjust the chain or anything else. Nothing fancy, not the lightest, nor the stiffest (6061 aluminum) ... but they seem fine!

I rode the new cranks on the Ramax for the first time today and ... I think I am going to really like this change. The bottom of the stroke is 7.5mm higher, and top is 7.5mm lower, so in total the leg rotation diameter is 15mm (1.5cm) less from top to bottom. I moved the seat up about 7.5mm, not precisely measured but it felt right. 

This is not a big change in the scheme of things, but very noticeable. I did not ride faster today over the full route -- I was riding with a friend -- but I did not ride slow. I found that when I wanted to push ahead a bit, I felt I could do so and hold the speed with less stress on the legs. Of course, it is just a wee bit easier to get in the drops or get down low with my arms on the hoods with my legs coming up just slightly less into my chest. And getting out the saddle and pedaling while standing -- dancing on the pedals -- was noticeably easier with the slightly smaller rotation. Maybe I just had fresh legs after a couple nights of decent sleep? Or maybe I was noticing a difference?! And I really did feel that perhaps these cranks will mean less stress on my joints, especially my knees.

I'll try this set of 165mm cranks for some time and on a series of rides ... then figure out if I want to change out other bikes as well. ... I may be having a sale on 172.5mm cranks in coming months?!